Grateful Dead

Cornell 5/8/77 (5LP)


WHAT DEAD HEADS HAVE BEEN SAYING ABOUT...

CORNELL 5/8/77
“...the single best rock performance anywhere, anytime, by anyone.”

“There was just some kind of magical connection this night between the band members and the band and the audience - some texture, or some type of cosmic or celestial force is in the room.”

"This show is, was, and always will be Mecca.”

The Grateful Dead played more than 2,000 concerts, but none continues to spark interest and provoke discussion quite like the band’s performance at Cornell University’s Barton Hall on May 8, 1977. It is one of the most collected, traded, and debated concerts by any band ever, has topped numerous fan polls through the years, and was a favorite of the group’s longtime archivist Dick Latvala, who stated: “Enough can’t be said about this superb show.” Even Uncle Sam got into the act in 2011 when the recording was “deemed so important to the history and culture of the United States” that a copy was added to the Library of Congress’ National Recording Registry.

Limited edition of 7,700
Release Date: May 5, 2017

Product Details

Sourced from the master Betty Boards, transferred and restored by Plangent Processes
Mastered in HDCD by Jeffrey Norman
Artwork by Grammy-winning graphic artist Masaki Koike
In-depth essay by noted Dead scholar Nicholas Meriwether
Limited edition of 7,700
Release Date: May 5, 2017

First Listen: "Morning Dew" 5/8/77

"Mind-roasting"? Don't mind if we "dew." Rollingstone.com's got an exclusive sneak preview of what might be the most magical "Morning Dew" of all time.

Product Details

Barton Hall, Cornell University - Ithaca, NY (5/8/77)

Disc 1
1. New Minglewood Blues
2. Loser
3. El Paso
4. They Love Each Other
5. Jack Straw
6. Deal
7. Lazy Lightning>
8. Supplication
9. Brown-Eyed Women
10. Mama Tried
11. Row Jimmy

Disc 2
1. Dancing In The Street
2. Scarlet Begonias>
3. Fire On The Mountain
4. Estimated Prophet

Disc 3
1. St. Stephen>
2. Not Fade Away>
3. St. Stephen>
4. Morning Dew
5. One More Saturday Night

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August West Wharf Rat's picture
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Joined: Nov 1 2013
thanks for the info greengo!

Thanks for the detailed knowledge! I am sure it will sound great and since I got jammed on the big box, this will be good to have.

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Joined: Feb 16 2017
HDCD - reply to boblopes

My understanding is the HDCD decoding takes place in conjunction with the initial DAC. So your analog out from the CD player is HDCD decoded (if the player has the feature), and then you're golden no matter what you do with it after that. The digital out from your CD player, on the other hand, would not be HDCD decoded. When used that way, the CD deck is called a "transport."

Currently I have a (non-HDCD) Onkyo CD player into a mid-range Onkyo amp, and even though they both have DACs of similar specs, they're different brands. The sound that results is noticeably better using the CD player's DAC, even though that means there's an analog cable between them, which unlike digital cables can itself be an issue for quality.

boblopes's picture
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Joined: Jan 13 2009
HDCD question

I know that the last digital device in a digital chain (CD -> preamp) must be able to decode HDCD in order to get the benefit of HDCD.

But, does anyone know if I played my analog out of my Oppo DVD player (HDCD capable) and inputted the analog signal into my DSP PreAmp, would the Analog to Digital Conversion (ADC) strip the HDCD benefit out?

I suspect yes but wanted to know if anyone knew definitively.

Thanks!!!

PS: I know this thread is about the analog album, but the discussion as of late has been HDCD.

reijo29's picture
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Joined: Jun 18 2012
HDCD

After years of listening to so many of all these GD releases I always wondered if I was missing something by not having an HDCD player. On the Steve Hoffman Forums someone suggested I should buy a used Oppo or Denon (cheaper) CD player. Finally this past November I purchased on Ebay a DENON DCM-390 Black 5 Disc Cd Player for about $45 all in. Wow what a difference, it seems to me the mids and highs are clearer and the music has more presence. My system is very basic as in a 1991 Onkyo 80 watt receiver & current Klipsch RPM 350 speakers. I listen to the GD about 75% of the time (king Crimson live shows are second most, their Starless box set is my second favorite box set after E72) I am glad I made the HDCD switch.

I am also all in on this vinyl set!

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Joined: Nov 3 2010
oops! HDCD not SACD...my bad!

I'm getting old! You are correct...Dead stuff is HDCD...not SACD. The new OPPO dvd players will not play HDCD. You will have to find a used one...on Ebay?...to play your discs. I did.
Sorry for the confusion on this issue. Getting "old" is a difficult thing to deal with. The next thing I will be posting that the grateful dead played a concert in Esperence, New York. When you see that appear then hopefully someone will delete my account on dead.net.

Mr. Pete------------>
aging hippie

eyes43's picture
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Joined: Apr 9 2013
HDCD Encoding

This may have already been brought up, i was just checking the last few posts, but i will post this info, anyhow! Windows media player decodes and plays HDCD formatting. As HDCD technology is owned by Microsoft. You can play these discs through your laptop, using windows media player and hook it to your stereo using quality wiring, and enjoy the HDCD effect. I use an older windows laptop, i no longer use for anything else, and have it hooked up to my harman kardon with nice cables, and use it exclusively for my dead discs, and keep it always hooked up to relisten.com, so i can click on a year, a date, a source, and click play, and be listening to any show from the archive, using this much easier site, I want. And it's not limited to just the Grateful Dead...Phish, Ween, and just about every band worth listening to, has a live show section! Relisten's mobile app for iPhone only, is the $hit! I use it on a daily basis!
"The Kids They Dance, And Shake Their Bones!"

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Joined: Feb 16 2017
SACD?

But Mr. Pete ... what from the Dead has been released in SACD? The Oppo UDP-203 has dropped HDCD support (according to the FAQ at http://watershade.net/wmcclain/UDP-203-faq.htm). All these Dead CDs are HDCD. Did they have some SACD releases?

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Joined: Nov 3 2010
OPPO UPD-203 has sacd capability...great dvd/cd players

For those who are looking to "really" upgrade your dvd player and get a great sacd player thrown in...Check out the new OPPO UPD-203 player. A bit expensive but nothing else compares. I have had Oppo's since they first came out and all I can say is the company is "wonderful" do deal with. All the stereo/video reviews give their products wonderful reviews. Quality of their product(s) is top shelf!
And..I am sure you will hear a difference between a dead cd in sacd..and...not in sacd.

Mr. Pete------------>
aging hippie

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Joined: Feb 16 2017
HDCD

Off topic for vinyl, but thanking Pete for the HDCD review, since that's something I've been wondering about. The 2017 Oppos have dropped HDCD decoding. Used ones of course still have it.

New, there's an Emotiva CD player for $500 that still has it, and that some claim has better fidelity even than the Oppos. Unlike them it only plays CDs though. Personally I'm holding off on a vinyl purchase for this -- do have the order in for the CD box -- half thinking that the money can be better spent to get more out of all the Dead CDs I've piled up. Not that my Onkyo player sounds bad. But the HDCDs on it do sound less clear in the louder passages, which is where to a normal CD player the HDCD recording should come through as compressed.

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Joined: Nov 3 2010
HDCD is...better

I purchased a used OPPO player just for the HDCD playback. It does sound better when I a/b the discs with my other cd player. Look on eBay, etc, and see if you can find a use OPPO. They make the best dvd/cd players for the money.

Mr. Pete--------->
aging hippie

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Joined: Jul 3 2007
HDCD

I think is a holdover from the CD description and won't apply to the vinyl. I don't understand it fully but from what I gather, HDCD is a way to master using 20 digital bits instead of the CD red book standard 16 bits, but can still be played back with a normal CD player. I believe you don't actually get any HDCD benefit unless you have an HDCD decoder on your CD player, which exists only on the higher end models. In fact, not many record labels even issue anything utilizing the process anymore. I do hear if you have the right player it does make a difference though. I don't have one so I can't say for sure. Assuming the transfer from tape was at least 96k 24b, hopefully there was a separate hi-res master made to cut the vinyl. Rarely do you get this kind of specific info from the labels.

boblopes's picture
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Joined: Jan 13 2009
You Go Greengo!!!

Thanks for the prompt response - never thought they had one shot after the baking process. It is pretty remarkable, we are such lucky fans...

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Joined: Jul 3 2007
Some digital/analog thoughts on vinyl

From an audio engineer's perspective (and vinyl guy), I think we are lucky these tapes even played back, as it sounds like they may not have been stored properly. If so you would really only want to play them back once or twice, after baking them in a convection oven for roughly 8 hours. Then you get one playback and need to bake again. This would mean there is no way you would cut vinyl directly from the master tape. At most you would make a tape to tape copy and then cut vinyl from that, which is how the Beatles Mono vinyl box set was made (and sounds amazing btw). Cutting directly from tape requires specialized tape decks with a preview head sent to the cutter, as well as someone who is very good at doing that. It would definitely be a more expensive process, which would be passed onto us. That said it could be done like the Beatles set, and I also prefer all analog cuts, but I think this option is a viable way to go considering the condition of the tapes. Also a lot of mastering engineers rave about the plangent process, so I feel confident they will sound amazing and will be listening as soon as they arrive!

boblopes's picture
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Joined: Jan 13 2009
Album layout should be a requirment

I agree, I'd like to know how they will pull this off. It would be nice to hear more about the Analog -> remaster -> plangent -> analog processing too but that's the audio geek in me talking...

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Joined: Aug 10 2011
LP Layout

I don't want to come off as a dick... But couldn't you market each item differently? Like when you search the LP you see the breakdown per album? Not the layout for the CD?

Riis's picture
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Joined: Apr 17 2009
It's going to sound better

It's going to sound better than the CD. 100% sure.

Here's more on the process

http://www.plangentprocesses.com/page2.html

Riis's picture
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Joined: Apr 17 2009
Actually, I'm fine with some

Actually, I'm fine with some precision mastering. Have you heard any of the other recent vinyl releases? They're doing really good work.

simonrob's picture
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Joined: Jun 7 2007
[ADA] -v- [AAA]

What it says at the top of the page is: "Sourced from the master Betty Boards, transferred and restored by Plangent Processes. Mastered in HDCD by Jeffrey Norman".
If this sequence applies to the vinyl version, then first the Plangent Processes read the analog tape, make the corrections etc. and output a digital version. Subsequent mastering to HDCD is thus somewhat irrelevant - the Plangent output is digital. This is what I understand from reading about the process on Plangent's website. The question then becomes: Which would provide the better sound: analog mastering direct from Betty's masters or a Plangent restored digital version subsequently mastered to HDCD, then cut to analog discs?

August West Wharf Rat's picture
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Joined: Nov 1 2013
Why analogue to HDCD back to Analogue? Say it ain't so...

If this is true I will be canceling my order of the 5LP box as I will have the CD too anyway.

Can we get a straight answer from GDP/R about if and why this LP was not (if not) from analogue source (Betty's tapes) to vinyl?
if GDP/R will not answer,can any audiophile heads want to clue me in as to why? other thatn 'SO it can be Normanized'?

I don't get it. am I missing something here?

WE WANT THE PURE ANALOGUE SOUND FROM THE SOURCE/MASTER TAPES WHENEVER POSSIBLE, THAT'S WHY WE BUY VINYL

PLEASE ANSWER SOMEONE BEFORE 5/5/17 SO I CAN CANCEL MY LP ORDER.

andyhead's picture
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Joined: May 10 2012
Oh yehhhh!!

Mine ordered :)

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Joined: Apr 10 2008
@mcgruber

I'm wondering if the HDCD note was just a transfer from the CD listings. Wouldn't seem to make sense to master these from HDCD. However, many represses released these days are mastered from hi def digital. Now, mastering wax from hi def digital will arguably sound better than CD (more information present), but is not identical to mastering from analog. It's likely all live Dead being released, from DaP to RSD vinyl only releases, are being mastered to hi def digital and then on to either CD, FLAC, vinyl, etc.

All this being said, I have all the recent live vinyl releases, and they all sound quite good. So, my question is what is the actual source for the vinyl mastering? I've never seen vinyl listed as sourced from HDCD. Maybe someone at Dead.net/Rhino can chime in with more info.

Also, commence the audiophile discussions and debates about why higher def format than Redbook (CD) matters or doesn't matter:)

80sgratefuldead's picture
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Joined: Feb 20 2017
Love Cornell but we need some 80's shows!!!!

Hey Dave, we ran some analytics on GD releases, where are the 80's shows? Check out our blog at http://www.eightiesgratefuldead.com

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Joined: Mar 8 2015
Analog -> HDCD Digital -> Analog. WHY??

Why would you take the beautiful analog copies of this from the Betty boards, transfer and master it in HDCD, then transfer it back to Analog. Seems to defeat the purpose of audio fidelity and will be the reason why I am not ordering this, and also the reason why I canceled my 7" subscriptions.

Come on GPD. Get it together. You know better!!! And that's whats frustrating.

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Joined: Jun 5 2007
Quite a record.

It should be pretty sweet on LP!!
I was gonna rant about the price, but..

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Joined: Nov 3 2010
5 lp collection...

I have purchased both the box set and the lp collection. Since I am 70 years old I have a preference for LP's. I guess, growing up in the 60's one becomes a tuned to the nice mellow sound of analog. I bet this LP collection will even sound better with a tube amp!
I had a discussion, on Saturday, with some guys approximately my age discussing their kids music habits..via cell phones. Both said that their kids never listened to anything completely. They skip from one song to another. I was listening to a discussion by a person who owns a music service, on NPR?, and made the comment that from their research most people do not even finish a complete song.
To me, sitting down with an album cover, a good bowl of English pipe tobacco with my favorite meerschaum pipe, and a glass of good beer/scotch and just reading the LP cover...and listening to the music....from start to finish...is one of life's greatest pleasures.
So, I cannot wait until the Cornell set comes out. Now, all I have to do is live long enough!

Mr. Pete------------>
aging hippie

p.s. I turned these gentlemen on to The Paul Butterfield bands LP...East-West. One of my all time favorite blues LP's. The song...East-West...is a master piece.

simonrob's picture
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Joined: Jun 7 2007
Digital download - only ten left.

I took that to mean what it says, you can download the digital single ten times and you haven't downloaded it once yet. I got the same message when I ordered the box set within a half hour of its announcement. Do you think it refers to the number of 5LP sets left?

adamz's picture
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Joined: Jun 19 2008
Just ordered one and the remaining digital download said 10 left

If you order one of these, look at the confirmation thing and see if it also says 10 left for the digi download:
like this ...

1 x Digital Single - “Scarlet Begonias > Fire On The Mountain” $0.00
Download (10 left)
...
Maybe it's just a default value for if there's more than 10 left.

Anyhow, looking forward to this. I just got my vinyl player reborn and it wails...
AZ

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Joined: Nov 5 2010
Caution

Be Aware of that cmovieboxapp's links. He's a spammer, he could be trying to put malware on your computers!

bigradio's picture
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Joined: Jul 3 2007
Filler Dreams...

Killer side 10 filler could have been Wharf Rat, Around Around, U.S. Blues from Boston Garden 5/7/77...

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Joined: Feb 1 2017
Side 10

This will be my first Vinyl that has a "custom etching" no audio side?? Why wouldn't they put some sort of filer on the 10th side? Seems like a waste of Vinyl? This is what I do every time I make some one a copy of any show and there is extra space?? Put something tasty that makes 'em want more. Or a chance to turn them on to something else??

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Joined: Feb 16 2011
Cosmology

One aspect of the Cornell show no one seems to reflect about is the fact the show virtually took place where and when Carl Sagan recorded the GOLDEN RECORD for the Voyager Mission. At the University of Cornell ... late spring-early summer 1977. This unique record has now travelled to Interstellar Space with Voyager 1, launched in mid-1977. The Voyager Mission is a major achievement for humanity, sort of a Dark Star of our modern age. The Golden Record will last for another 100 million years in outer space (!) following Nasa.

And then there is another GOLDEN RECORD, covering a show recorded at the same spot and time ... by a certain Betty Cantor Jackson.

Cosmology, eh?

I placed my order for the GOLDEN VINYL RECORD ... drunk on Burgundy whine

Bjorn Forsberg, Bursiljum Sweden

bigradio's picture
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Joined: Jul 3 2007
Track Listing = No Jam Splits

From what I can tell they have mastered this so there will be no flipping sides during transitions; at the expense of having the 10th side of record 5 with no audio... I have several of the recent vinyl Dead releases - 11/18/72, 4/25/77, and 5/4/79... all released by Rhino... All are done to limit fades/music breaks... I think there is one between drums and wharf rat on 4/25/77, but its tasteful... I hope the release include Bobby's take a step back before scarlet...

https://archive.org/details/gd77-05-08.sbd.hicks.4982.sbeok.shnf/gd77-05...

simonrob's picture
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Actual list of tracks on sides...

Actual list of tracks on sides is here:

https://www.spincds.com/coming-soon/cornell-5-8-77-3-cd-52360

Geoffbingo27, I don't quite understand what it is that you are concerned about. Were you hoping for Dancin'>Scarlet>Fire>Estimated on one side of an LP? Last time I looked, LPs had a diameter of 12" and could contain around 20 minutes of music.

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Joined: Feb 17 2017
seem to be?

i got really nervous when i saw the disc and it said that scarlet>fire was in between dancin' in the streets and estimated prophet. i was like "if they split it up, what's the point?!"

is this your speculation based on song lengths and songs that transition into each other, or did you find the actual list of tracks on sides somehwere?

owlshead's picture
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Joined: Jan 18 2014
Invalid Field message

What is it with ordering?? everything was just exactly right, i tripled checked!

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Joined: Jun 6 2007
Digital link in the chain

If this was all analog I would order this.

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Joined: Feb 16 2017
Finally got it

Took the better part of the day, but a friend finally got through last night and ordered one on my behalf, and I followed course as soon as I got the text--just in case. So, if all goes well, I will have two of the vinyl sets of Barton. Very much surprised at what seems an all-too-small 7,700 pressing. Whether true or not--and we all know opinions vary--this has long been held up as the penultimate show, and so any Head who is also a vinyl addict, and there must be more than 7,700 of us out there, will have to have a copy. If, in fact, I end up with two, I won't profit--hell, I gave away my second tickets to Fare Thee Well. The spare will either be held, un-played, for safekeeping, or sold at list when and if the right situation arises. But I am troubled by how this has played out. Yesterday's frenzy seems an online version of Altamont, and it shouldn't be that way. Here's hoping that stuff gets figured out better next time.

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Joined: Feb 16 2017
Re: Nine sides

If you have to ask, you'll never understand.

Peace.

ironman88's picture
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Joined: Jun 8 2007
9 Sides of Vinyl

Sorry to all you vinyl fetishists out there but 9 sides of vinyl for one show? That's kinda like the old days of '78s when it took 23 discs to listen to a complete Beethoven Symphony isn't it.

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Joined: Dec 29 2016
New Barton Hall Photos

Thrilled to have one of my photos grace the announcement today: http://www.billboard.com/articles/columns/rock/7694096/grateful-dead-40t...

I've got a treasure trove of photos from this show and I'm working on a book to share them with the world. Check out my fb page and like it to keep posted: https://www.facebook.com/GDBartonHallPhotos/.

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Joined: Feb 16 2017
Thwarted

Your website completely blocked my attempts to order this item. The 403 Admin Error would not let me add to the cart, then it would add multiple items to the cart, and then I could not update my cart. Life is too short...I gave up.

marcdenn's picture
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Joined: Jul 16 2015
Just now - 9:10pm est.

been trying since this afternoon. It finally went through, but it made me go directly to the Rhino store, which was weird. But it worked :)

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Joined: Jul 22 2008
Analog sourced

Why didn't you master the vinyl direct from the analog master? Now this vinyl is digitally sourced.

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Joined: Mar 6 2015
FINALLY!!!

Thanks for figuring it out, finally got my order done...man...spent all day refreshing, really wanted this vinyl release, I am sure there will be plenty of CD box sets, since they will be making 15k...

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Joined: Nov 24 2007
Thank you admins :)

I was just able to make the purchase - thank you for fixing the process :) :)

No more whining from me!

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Joined: Nov 24 2007
Sorry about the double posts - slow site <eom>

Ugh.

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Joined: Nov 24 2007
403 error :(

Seriously bummed here... can't add this to my cart due to 403 error!

Hello Hello Hello? Admin??

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Joined: Nov 24 2007
http 403 error

I can't add this to the cart!

403 error :(

Totally bummed.

simonrob's picture
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Joined: Jun 7 2007
9 sides and an etching...

This would seem to be the real layout for the LP version:

Side 1

1. New Minglewood Blues
2. Loser
3. El Paso

Side 2

1. They Love Each Other
2. Jack Straw
3. Deal

Side 3

1. Lazy Lightning>
2. Supplication
3. Brown-Eyed Women

Side 4

1. Mama Tried
2. Row Jimmy

Side 5

1. Dancing In The Street

Side 6

1. Scarlet Begonias>
2. Fire On The Mountain

Side 7

1. Estimated Prophet

Side 8

1. St. Stephen>
2. Not Fade Away>
3. St. Stephen

Side 9

1. Morning Dew
2. One More Saturday Night

Side 10

{Custom Etching- No Audio}

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