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    marye
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    When our previous topic hit the 1,000-response mark, sleazy behavior by politicians was eliciting a certain amount of non-astonishment.

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  • DeadnWindsor
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    A little non Dead advice from the musical world
    It's amazing to me that no one is up in arms protesting the choices of governments recently politicians are suposed to be civil servents, not CEOs, but today I see little difference. Both award themseleves bonuses and raises while the average citizen watches their standard of living go backwards. I know things are bad all over and much worse in the non developed world. I just hear so much frustration, I am so frustrated, yet not enough of us are willing to rise up and shout and hold our elected civil servents accountable. Okay enough of my ranting, there are those out there that can do it much better...and here I give you lyrics by Crass. Some of the references are dated, but the message still applies: (Note: I do not endorse all sentiments expressed in this song, but the overall message of personal responsibility always makes me think...and most often feel guilty I'm not doing more) Big A, little A, bouncing B The system might have got you but it won't get me 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 External control are you gonna let them get you? Do you wanna be a prisoner in the boundaries they set you? You say you want to be yourself, by christ do you think they'll let you? They're out to get you get you get you get you get you get you get you Hello, hello, hello, this is the Lord God, can you hear? Hellfire and damnation's what I've got for you down there On earth I have ambassadors, archbishop, vicar, pope We'll blind you with morality, you'd best abandon any hope, We're telling you you'd better pray cos you were born in sin Right from the start we'll build a cell and then we'll lock you in We sit in holy judgement condemning those that stray We offer our forgiveness, but first we'll make you pay External control are you gonna let them get you? Do you wanna be a prisoner in the boundaries they set you? You say you want to be yourself, by christ do you think they'll let you? They're out to get you get you get you get you get you get you get you Hello, hello, hello, now here's a massage from your queen As figurehead of the status quo I set the social scene I'm most concerned about my people, I want to give them peace So I'm making sure they stay in line with my army and police My prisons and my mental homes have ever open doors For those amongst my subjects who dare to ask for more Unruliness and disrespect are things I can't allow So I'll see the peasants grovel if they refuse to bow External control are you gonna let them get you? Do you wanna be a prisoner in the boundaries they set you? You say you want to be yourself, by christ do you think they'll let you? They're out to get you get you get you get you get you get you get you Introducing the Prime Sinister, she's a mother to us all Like the dutch boy's finger in the dyke her arse is in the wall Holding back the future waiting for the seas to part If Moses did it with is faith, she'll do it with an army Who at times of threatened crisis are certain to be there Guarding national heritage no matter what or where Palaces for kings and queens, mansions for the rich Protection for the wealthy, defence of privilege They've learnt the ropes In Ireland, engaged in civil war Fighting for the ruling classes in their battle against the poor So Ireland's just an island? It's an island of the mind Great Britain? Future? Bollocks, you'd better look behind Round every other corner stands P.C. 1984 Guardian of the future, he'll implement the law He's there as a grim reminder that no matter what you do Big brothers system's always there with his beady eyes on you From God to local bobby, in home and street and school They've got your name and number while you've just got their rule We've got to look for methods to undermine those powers It's time to change the tables. The future must be ours Big A, little A, bouncing B The system might have got you but it won't get me Be exactly who you want to be, do what you want to do I am he and she is she but you're the only you No one else has got your eyes, can see the things you see It's up to you to change your life and my life's up to me The problems that you suffer from are problems that you make The shit we have to climb through is the shit we choose to take If you don't like the life you live, change it now it's yours Nothing has effects if you don't recognise the cause If the programme's not the one you want, get up, turn off the set It's only you that can decide what life you're gonna get If you don't like religion you can be the antichrist If your tired of politics you can be an anarchist But no one ever changed the church by pulling down a steeple And you'll never change the system by bombing number ten Systems just aren't made of bricks they're mostly made of people You may send them into hiding, but they'll be back again If you don't like the rules they make, refuse to play their game If you don't want to be a number, don't give them your name If you don't want to be caught out, refuse to hear their question Silence is a virtue, use it for your own protection They'll try to make you play their game, refuse to show your face If you don't want to be beaten down, refuse to join their race Be exactly who you want to be, do what you want to do I am he and she is she but you're they only you
  • Anonymous (not verified)
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    Hey GRTD
    Your link doesn't work. I saw part of the Ventura interview. He does have balls but he is hard to take seriously. There is nobody out there willing to take on the lobbyists. Arguing about which Dem. Repub. for presient makes me want to vomit Fuck official Washington - they are Romans waiting for Rome to burn. Which it obviously will. S&P is thinking of lowering the US Government's bond rating from AAA+. Talk about all down hill from here!!
  • Zomby D Wulf
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    Pacific Northwet
    As much as I love dissen the RepubliCONs:We enter a kitchen in middle America. The family is gathered around the kitchen table. An old woman is crying over a pile of medical bills. Her Son and his wife try to comfort her. On the TV Sen. Bohner rails against Medicare and Social Security. Her 5yo grandson speaks, " Daddy why is the Mean Orange man trying to Kill Gramdma? " Any real news about some Northwest dates before the rain comes back in Sept? Like in August?? We are beginning to feel left out . I can't do the June 3.4 Shoreline shows as my Wife will be in the Hospital Actually it's still raining here and has made it to a blistering 44 deg today 423shows and counting. The Bus came by and I got on a Long strange time ago
  • GRTUD
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    Polling Question:
    What does everyone think of the Dapper Don's Presidential motivations? My take is; same old song and dance... just a different hairdoo. Of all the political items I've seen lately on TV; the Jesse Ventura interview on CNN a few weeks back takes the cake for balls. Way to go Jesse! I'll vote for you if you run! "What's gonna happen to the arms industry when we realize that we're all one?" ~ Bill Hicks
  • Anonymous (not verified)
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    Presidential Library for Wolfbat's tapes?
    Slated for the bottom of the largest copper pit in Butte, Montana ~ Please don't dominate the rap jack If you got nothin' new to say ~
  • wolfbat
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    I'm confused........
    Actually I've been confused since 1974......isnt Richard Nixon still president of the united states?[I wanted to ask him if he would trade me a tape]
  • Anonymous (not verified)
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    The Red River always gets my attention...
    ....every year Ted. I knew this was going to be a big year but are you sure that it's cresting 38-39 feet ABOVE flood stage above Fargo? (Checking) "FARGO – The Red River crested in Fargo-Moorhead at 38.75 feet at about 6:15 p.m. Saturday, according to the National Weather Service. Meanwhile, widespread breakout flooding Sunday was causing the highest flood levels ever seen in northeastern Cass County and northwestern Clay County, the Weather Service said. Saturday’s crest in the metro area ranks the 2011 flood as the fourth highest on record behind 1897 (39.10); 1997 (39.72) and 2009 (40.84). Since cresting Saturday, the river has been slowly falling in the Fargo area and Sunday’s rainfall, just under three-quarters of an inch by 10:30 p.m., was not expected to push the river back to crest level. However, the river will remain high for many days and it is not expected to fall below 36 feet before Sunday" It is great news that Fargo made it over the hump this year. The city had made a comeback and that ain't no small thing for a Dakota plains town. I really wish those people the very best as well as those downstream. It never ends in Fargo, just makes the biggest headlines there. It would seem that the figures sighted are official crest of the river, not the number of feet above flood stage. 38 feet above flood stage would be biblical. ~ Wake of the flood, laughing water, forty nine Get out the pans, don't just stand there dreaming, get out the way Get out the way ~
  • Gr8fulTed
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    Red River is rising
    After a marathon winter in North Dakota and Minnesota, the north-flowing Red River is cresting 38' or 39' above flood stage, inundating communities north of Fargo. Sandbags and levees may not be plentiful or strong enough to hold back the water. Feds are off to work this morning after a shutdown was averted with an 11th hour agreement Friday night. Let's see what tomorrow brings, eh? Did another tremblor hit Japan this morning???
  • gratefaldean
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    Gonz
    I appreciate your mental picture of me with patches and pipe. Slightly different life path, that could have been me, for sure. And I AM moderately reasonable, within reason...
  • Anonymous (not verified)
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    Hocklney?
    Can we set up the gallows and hang Boehner, Cantor, Reid and Pelosi right now? While the cherry blossoms are in bloom? In front of the Lincoln Memorial?
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When our previous topic hit the 1,000-response mark, sleazy behavior by politicians was eliciting a certain amount of non-astonishment.
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SAN FRANCISCO - SOPHOS computer security firm on Friday warned that hackers are spreading a nasty computer virus with a file promising a PowerPoint presentation of sexual positions from the Kama Sutra. 'Be careful what you do with that mouse,' Mr Graham Cluley of Sophos said in an online post. 'When you click on the file you do get to see a real PowerPoint presentation, but in the background a backdoor Trojan called Troj/Bckdr-RFM is installed which allows hackers to gain remote access to your computer.' Once a computer is infected with the malicious software, the hacker can steal personal information and spy on users' activities or use the machine for nefarious deeds such as sending spam or attacking websites. In scant consolation, the booby-trapped file did present slides of more than a half dozen lovemaking techniques illustrated from the ancient Indian text, according to Mr Cluley. -- AFP
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It has indeed been an illuminating and civilized discussion about the gun thing. It occurs to me that we are seeing two mirrored solutions to the same problem. If you were shut in a big barn with a random bunch of strangers you could argue that there were two ideal options for everyone getting along without too much trouble...either (1) everyone has a gun or (2) no-one has a gun. I can see that option 1 might make some sense if that is how your culture has developed, but personally I would always choose and work towards option 2 (much less stressful). But I can see that the more guns that are in that barn, the harder it is for folk to choose option 1. I suppose many of us are lucky enough to live in societies where we are able to have a say in the matter, and to live (or die) with the consequences of our choices. But I will always remain an option 2 guy.
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Brother Badger....
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cosmic-designer-> I'm in one of my heavy Dead listening phases right now so every thing I read or hear about elicits some Dead lyric in my head, and the Arizona situation, Palin's response, and the whole discussion of gun control, for me boils down to the lyric "No time to hate" and the general ambience of UJB. Some of us want to live in an option #2 world because hate is not something we consider or ever want to deal with. This not only affects our view on gun control, but generally it influences our ideas on immigration, health care, defense spending, etc. Unfortunately, there are a lot of people who have no problem and may actually look forward to MAKING time to hate, and as long as those people are out there, guns and other things will always be an issue. The goal of such folks is option #1, always. In a spiritual, metaphorical, almost allegorical way, the Dead addressed this in Uncle John's Band. Nice.
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Wanting to be able to defend yourself against hateful people does not make you a hateful person... and hateful people are out there, I cannot hide from that fact. I can only hope they will leave me alone in my desire to NOT hate..
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of starlings that fell to the ground and died in europe, were drunk on mash left over from wine making...
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seems as if the spammers are getting smarter, while pretending to be conversing, when in reality they are STILL slimy spammers! We are not so unintelligent as to fall for their wily ways!!********************************** I am not young enough to know everything. Oscar Wilde
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I couldn't resist... I went to my local gun shop and bought 4 glocks with 30 bullet clips, filled out a bit of paperwork, threw them in a sack and walked out the door wih the owner who was anxious to show me how to use them. He even threw in an extra, full clip for free to do the deed. The glock has quite a kick and together, the shopkeeper and I, we obliterated a human silhouette. I feel so much better now knowing that meat will be no problem this winter. I can put 131 slugs in a moose. Road rage? - no problemo. Somebody disrespects me lke a shopkeeper who won't take an item bAck? It's legal to carry concealed, though the clip is a bit bulky. All of these situations go through my mind -- as well as my neighbor who shoots off a clip now and then. Next time he does it I'll make believe I''m assaulting the mountain in back of his house , believing it''s a Taliban ridge in Helmund Province. The one thing I won't think of doing is fending off assailants or intruders because I live in a pretty good, safe neighborhood. I feel the power surging through me and my fellow 79 of 100 compatriots veins surrounding me in the US. Can't wait till my boss fires me or I see a bumper sticker I disagree with or drive by a tea-party gathering. I'll keep all my guns loaded in case I wake up due to a damn chattering squirrel I know I feel so much safer now that I'm with the majority. (The above has been satire to demonstrate a point , though in the state I Ilve in there is no waiting period and carrying concealed is not a crime.
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but there is a background check requirement, in order to buy from a federally licensed dealer, and if it comes back "do not proceed" then there IS a waiting period. Your post maybe satirical, but most firearms owners are responsible people and wouldn't do the things spelled out in your post. Haven't I said before that your neighbor is an idiot with no respect for the safety of others?....would you like to share a cookie with me?
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"It's got no signs or dividing line and very few rules to guide"
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takem mr gonzo i feel your pain brother!
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I really and truly think this whole issue is beyond the contents of our founding father's documents, lives and ideologies. Although I do like your cookie sharing idea johnman... only with a bit of a twist. I think we should give all citizens of the U.S.A. guns when they are newborns. After all; there's no age requirement for gun ownership (that I know of - I could be wrong of course) according to The U.S. Constitution's Second Amendment. And in all those pictures of places the U.S.A. is trying to deliver from tyranny, I see children holding weapons of all kinds - so they must be good just not used correctly? In addition, we should give each of the new gun owners two bullets... Or we could do this: Chris Rock ROCKS!!!
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This number 2 likes that one Grtud! Nice to see you again btw-AS EVER!! Johnman-here's a cookie! ********************************** I am not young enough to know everything. Oscar Wilde
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and at least here in America, as a rule, at least in MY home, children are not taught to hate others for there differences, political, ideological, religious, skin-color, clothing, or otherwise....so sorry if my support of the Constitution offends anyone. I remain, Respectfully, and affectionately yours johnman
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also Johnman-don't see anybody offended.********************************** I am not young enough to know everything. Oscar Wilde
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Firearms ownership is a subject I have always been extremely hesitant to broach here as it is as divisive as politics (which I dislike with a passion). I was taught at an early age a healthy respect for them, and how dangerous they are. Ownership is a grave responsibility, one that should NEVER be taken lightly, and I apologize if my defense of them has stepped on any toes. In my home as a child I was taught that it was a right to defend one's self, a right that should never be given up, and defending others is a privilege not granted to many. My post earlier on hate is, of course, incorrect. There are folks in this country that live and breath hate, on all sides of the political and ideological spectrum, and they infect others around them, but as a general rule, we don't teach that, the Constitution is there for all citizens, and of course, having a difference of opinion is healthy, and discussing those opinions keeps your mind alert.....I think, however that this dead horse can be beaten from now 'til doomsday (December, next year?..heehee!) and it STILL ain't gonna get up..
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what I CAN agree on you with-8 gazillion percent even-is it is our solemn duty as parents to teach our children not to hate. Whoa, let me put it differently: It is our solemn duty as parents NOT to teach our children to hate. There, that is more correct, because children are not born haters!!********************************** I am not young enough to know everything. Oscar Wilde
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I agree with you on that too :)********************************** I am not young enough to know everything. Oscar Wilde
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Unless you are one of 3 or 4 people. My parting comment is I agree with johnman's stance on guns and the constitution. I also respect other's who absolutely hate guns and want them all eliminated from the planet. And yes I am absolutely on board with the notion that it is our duty as parents to teach our children tolerance. I like what Tiger Lilly said how children are not born haters, but it is our job to keep re-enforcing that with them. It can be ugly out there and it doesn't take long for our innocent babies to fall victim of the ugliness.. Ok so long, I'm heading back to the less-controversial world of the vineyard where occasionly we debate but everyone's points are considered and much less harshly ... I thought we are all on the same team here .. "It's got no signs or dividing line and very few rules to guide"
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about where you felt hostility?? Either I am completely idiotic-but all I saw was people stating their opinions.********************************* I am not young enough to know everything. Oscar Wilde
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I agree, Jackstraw--I have seen some pileons in my time, and this ain't one of 'em... And hell, I'm fairly conflicted on the issue myself.
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And hoping that my "cookie gun" link (meant to be a joke) wasn't taken the wrong way.
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how about a cookie shooting cannon??....kinda like the "punkin' chunkin'" thing??
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A "paintball" gun that shoots cookie dough? Mmmmm, cookie dough...
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there is a discussion going on here some people agree with you some people disagree jackstraw is all,you are intitled to your opinion and i for one will respect that,maybe you should be more specific and maybe we should drop the gun thing it saddens me anyway.
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want to talk about this grateful dead video game to be released by rhino next year i think ?
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I saw a few things bur have not looked into it...I'm too fat to be Pig and too stupid to be Jerry, I'm wondering if you play a bandmember or what?
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is that pudding, or what?
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And I don't want to make it bigger than it really is. There is no hostility or anything like that (maybe mild piling-on lol). But there is a strong click in this thread (and some of the others - like the Road Trips threads for example) and if you are not apart of it then your opinions are scoffed at in a subtle way and in some cases not so subtle no matter what your stance and especially if it is against the majority's opinion. It's just the vibe I get here. That's totally fine if you don't agree with me but it's there. I am not going to tattle on any one that's ridiculous but I will just avoid this thread on dead.net. Most of the issues discussed here don't have a right or wrong answer and because of that, it usually leads to someone being pissed off or feelings hurt. I am sure I am making way too big a deal out of it but still, it's not worth it. Again, no biggie, no worries, go on with you discussions. I apologize for any drama. Take care. "It's got no signs or dividing line and very few rules to guide"
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what that stuff is...frosting? pudding? cream cheese?....
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will be on fb from aug 1st!!!!!!!
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Wait, did we GET a Patient's Bill of Rights? I'm talkin' the Time is Money Amendment Goes something like this: say, for example, that you have to drive your wife to an appointment (a "consultation") with an oral surgeon. You leave work at 1:45 pm (3 hr 15 minutes early), drive 40 minutes home, then 20 minutes to the place. Arrive about 15 minutes early because you KNOW there's going to be a bunch of paperwork to fill out. 3 pm comes and goes, then 3:15, 3:30, 3:45, 4:00, 4:15...then at 4:20 she gets called from the waiting room to the inner sanctum (session lasts over an hour, costs over $300, and we'll be looking at a second mortgage to cover the cost of the work that needs to be done -- no Europe 72 box for me!). I spent the entire time, until the paying part, cooling my heels in the waiting room, watching it slowly empty out until I was the only one left. The receptionist must have been wondering who I was and why I was loitering in her space. This is the medical industry's equivalent of an airline overbooking a flight: selling you a time slot that they don't actually have available. So here's the Amendment: based on the wait, it's obvious that my time, my wife's time, is worth nothing to the dentist. Soooo...I'll give you a 15 -minute grace period against the appointment time. But given that doctors and dentists will charge you if you don't show up for an appointment, I want a 5% rebate against the retail cost of the visit for every 15 minutes spent waiting after the grace period. This is a direct payment to the patient, NOT a discount for the insurance company. My time, after all, is NOT worth nothing. This plan should have a positive effect by making the system more efficient, or by putting money back in my pocket, or by reducing the practice's patient load thus creating a demand for additional healthcare workers...all of which should be job- creating and not, as the GOP so foxily put it, "job killing." (Talk about trying to enact half-truths and deception into legislation..."job killing" is part of the name of a Bill? Sheeesh...). Time is Money...
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Actually, by the end of it, I was desperate for another kind of break...it was a long afternoon without a restroom in sight.
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a doctor's office with no restroom? how barbaric! :-)********************************** I am not young enough to know everything. Oscar Wilde
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But it was a pretty small waiting room...and I didn't get quite desperate enough to ask.
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As a non-violent activist I am watching in awe as first a self-immolation in Tunisia by a college student deposed a dictator and now a dozen more self-immolation's are encouraging mass uprisings in several countries. Fascists are slaughtering their own people in the street during demonstrations as we speak. I hope this starts a movement of freedom heard round the world . Muslims have always ruled with iron fists. Iran is the big one, but unlikely to go down. I think the sewers would coagulate with the blood of innocents there before the fucking imams give up. The power of non-violent civil disobedience is immense. Of course, what comes next is an open question. Better, worse? Who knows but I applaud their sacrifice and bravery. It is a lesson for us all. As the bankers and the medical companies and other assorted industries with vested interests continue to drain the wealth from our country, leading us to being the biggest debtor nation on the earth, with us waiting for the ax to fall, maybe their will be some amongts us brave enough to pull us back from tragedy with brave actions. What is freedom, what is a life well-lived and who will look honestly in the mirror and say thatt he USA is the pinnacle of civilization? These heroes fighting dictators in the Middle East are my alpha dogs for the year 2011. If this be sedition so be it. We're not even free enough to commit self-immolation in this country. Cameras everywhere, e-mails read, phones tapped, psychic profiles - plenty of numbness and narcissistic escape for those with money. Who among us would start such a movement in this country? Even if it would be mercilessly put down as in Iran (as it surely would). I am humbled today by news of braver people.
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Only Islamic countries that are friedly with the West are being brought dowh --Tunsia, Eqyi[y, Algeria, Jordan, Bahrain and others. A more unified radical Islam is is constituting itself.
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Gonzo-Egypt won't necessarily become more radically Islamic-85% of the population are against having a fundamentalist govt. BUT I guess it depends on what happens internally, and how much the West meddles, etc.********************************** I am not young enough to know everything. Oscar Wilde
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But this is a as historical as bringing the Berlin Walla tumbling Down, so far. tt is the pent up frustration of a diverse crowd and you have to wonder why Iraq, Iran & Afghanistan didn't go this way. And Billary issuing orders to other people's armies to stand down in the face of popular protest. Now what exactly is the difference between a terrorist and a freedom fighter?? Oh, a freedom fighter uses a kindler, gentler shrapnel bomb -- Yeah, that must be it!
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The most amazing thing about what is going on in Egypt- especially in light of the US's recent spat of "second amendment remedies" and gun violence (Tuscon, Detroit, college campuses across the country)- is the remarkable absence of guns and weapons on the streets. Yes, there is looting and people are having to defend their property with weapons- but the protestors, on the streets, are NOT waving guns or firing shots in the air. Violence and destruction are occurring, but considering the widespread protesting, AND considering the fact that the US media loves to hype up all violence to the point of distortion, I think that what we are seeing in Egypt is pretty remarkable.Compare this with Glenn Beck's rhetoric and Palin's crosshairs and the gun hysteria we have here. When (not IF) the day comes when people get fed up and take the streets here in the US, I doubt we are going to witness widespread protests as peaceful as Egypt's.
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In the 1960s the US and its allies supported nasty strong man leaders all across SE Asia and S America to protect their access to primary resources and to prevent the spread of communism. Millions suffered from the resulting abuses…people enslaved to protect the interests of Western democracies. In the last 20 years the policy has been the same for the Arab states. Sell us oil, leave Israel alone and we will pay you and you can do what you like to your own people. The uprisings in Tunisia and Egypt appear to be borne out of frustration with oppression and are definitely not Islamic revolutions. Of course the extreme Islamists will try to take advantage, but in both those countries by far the majority of ordinary people are not extremists. They are just like folks everywhere else. The most effective way to open the doors to radical Islam is to send in our boys to teach them democracy at gunpoint. Let these people determine their own futures even if you don’t like what they choose. Is that not the liberty that is so dear to Americans and the West, or is that liberty only issued in a limited edition?